One of our old friends returned to New York recently after spending time in Egypt and Turkey and Israel and India. As it happens, she can pass for a native of any or all of the above—in Egypt, Egyptians think at a glance that she’s Egyptian, in Turkey a Turk, and so forth. And so, while travelers from, say, Japan, or lighter-skinned, blonder-haired travelers from the U.S., got a pass, what our friend got was a great deal of unsolicited advice about what she shouldn’t do outdoors. Such as exist, outside the company of a man.
In Egypt in particular it wasn’t advice, it was exhortation: a woman in the street without a man by her side—either father, brother or husband—is any man’s, to do with as he will. And if she makes the mistake of dressing provocatively to boot, she is taking her life in her hands. (How many rapes per day are there in Cairo? Do you just want the official, reported figure…? How shall we count gang rapes?)
Of course, there is more going on in Cairo right now than attacks on women. But when the revolution passes (and it will, they always do), the plight of women will remain. On the “women’s car” on a train—and, my god, I could just stop there, couldn’t I? that there even is such a thing, in 2013—on the “women’s car” on a train, women covered from head to toe stole curious, eager, wondering glances at the western women, the ones who dared to wear short sleeves, and pants. But only glances, only peeks, and then they returned to their covered-up existence.
Why do we go topless in the park at the end of summer in the middle of New York City, where it is legal and any woman may do so if she wishes?
That’s why.
That’s fucking why.
I enjoy your posts and your mission. I’ve been a nudist for years. One of the things I enjoy about it is the de-emphasis of sexuality in social nudity. My question to you is, if your mission is to further top-freedom for women, why the necessity for the “Making reading sexy” tag line”
No necessity; it’s just a line we came up with the day we created the blog and that we liked at the time. We still like it just fine (there’s nothing wrong with being sexy or feeling sexy, and it’s nice to remind people of how exciting reading can be), but it reflects just one facet of what we’re up to, and if we knew of a way to change the tagline we probably would. Maybe we’d rotate among a batch of different taglines, one per season, or something like that. But despite hunting through the WordPress control panel at length, we haven’t found a way to change it. Probably we’re missing something simple and obvious, but…we’re missing it. Until that changes, the tagline is immutable.
Nice post – In order to change the tag line – From the WP Admin dashboard panel – Settings -> General. The Site Title and Tagline can be changed there.
Thanks! Going to check that out now…
Reading IS sexy, and y’all are helping us remember that. It’s true, so why change it. Very well written, by the way.
No argument, reading is sexy. But three years is a long time for a single tagline. It’s fun to change it up now and then, now that we know how. We’ll rotate through different ones. “Making Reading Sexy” will reappear from time to time, I’m sure.
“Freeing Our Bodies, Freeing Our Minds” is a fantastic tagline. Thank you for this post and your blog in general, I think you folks are great.
I get it. Nudists often say it’s not not about sex. OK. (I’ve never heard a female nudist say that, BTW.)
Since there’s no objective way to determine when something is or isn’t sexual, is there really a reason to object when someone uses the word ‘sexy’ in a positive way?
The whole “non-sexual” argument goes back to decades when people were hung-up about about sex. Most of us are past that now.
Be as non-sexual as you wanna be. But if someone shows a little flesh and is honestly sexy, there’s nothing wrong with that in the 21st Century.
Nothing at all wrong with being sexy. We love being sexy, and reading can definitely be sexy, if you do it right.
Best post yet!
On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 7:01 AM, The Outdoor Co-ed Topless Pulp Ficti
Amen.
[…] On Modesty. […]
Hi! Excellent commentary (and pictures, of course)! Just make sure she doesn’t go to India.
She did go to India.
I’m sorry! I read it quickly and missed India.
I agree that women should have the right to go nude whenever and wherever she wants. Like you said that your Law allows so why the fuck not. But If a woman chooses to cover up because her religions asks her to, then we should respect that too. If there is a compulsion to do so, thats wrong, Islam asks everyone to follow its code, but he doesn’t give others right to punish you. Instead its between you and God. But of you are mocking someone who chooses to cover up on his own free will then you are a hypocrite. And asks those women in trains whether they are forced to or they are happy to cover up ? My mom wears Hijab too, but I will never ask her to wear that or not to wear that. It’s her decision to follow her religion. So try not to be disrespectful when you are trying to be liberal. Also, when you go to someplace you should respect there culture and not mock it ! Independence of women is not about just clothing however it does include it. I agree with the things you said about rape and I think these kind of bad values should be discouraged.
We are not mocking anyone, certainly not anyone who chooses any behavior of his or her own free will. What we are expressing disdain for is, as you put it, compulsion. And there is a lot of compulsion in the world, especially of women.
We are delighted to hear that you think rape is a “bad value” that should be “discouraged.”
I agree you guys cannot talk poorly of those who choose to follow their religion, in islam women are actually looked upon very highly as men have to respect them and women have rights over men in marriage just as men do over women as well, covering in islam is part of being modest and keeping parts special only for you and your special someone, but we cannot force anyone to do anything, like the previous person said it’s their choice so plz understand those women choose to cover up because they want to follow their religion best they can!!!!!
We can, and do, and should talk poorly about people who abuse other people, people who subjugate other people, people who interfere with other people’s freedom. It is true that some women choose to cover up, and if they do, that’s fine–it’s their choice. It is also true that some women would prefer not to cover up but are forced, either by legal requirement or societal pressure or threat of physical violence (or all three) to do so, and that’s simply unacceptable.
How can u talk bad about other peoples religions??? They choose to follow it and fine some are forced by law and stuff, but your saying Egypt in which if you understood women only carts and stuff are for muslim women who want to follow their faith, but there are also many women in Egypt who dont cover up, its completely religious and in that case you cannot even talk poorly about their religion one bit, or u might as well take this site down for your ideology on freedom is actually not true, your ideology would be one of people must accept public nudity, which no one has to, its your choice do it for your own reasons not the reason to attract attention and force people to accept it.
We don’t “talk bad about other peoples religions.” We criticize people who subjugate and mistreat and abuse women. People who do that are not above criticism just because they do it in the name of religion.
true
That was awesome. And a great post for today. I’d say a title like Why we do what we do! would be appropriate because. Every jackass who questions your motives and says you’re looking for attention ought to read this. Nice work.
Thank you for making that particular point on this particular day! The world needs to remain clear on what is going on in Egypt and other places thereabouts, especially when it gets glossed over while we cozy up to these people.
This country isn’t perfect, but there are places in the world that is still the Wild West (Lara Logan, anyone?) Unfortunately, a lot of Americans aren’t aware of the global picture. For them the world begins and ends in their backyard
This reminded me of an article I seen yesterday about an 8 year old girl who died on her wedding night yes an 8yr old girl and the man was 40! These are the kind of things that sometimes make me wonder how much good is still left in this world when people don’t cannot even tell between what is right and wrong.
BRAVO !
( the post. The pictures, I can take em or leave ’em just as well )
I love all your posts, for many reasons. But this is the best post I’ve seen so far… hits the nail right on the head. Not to say that anything you girls do needs justification, but if someone is looking for it they can find it in this post no doubt.
Not to be off topic, but man is she beautiful.
I admire you all so much for your stand on women’s rights. Wish it were elsewhere.
Well said! And talk about segregation!
Too bad there’s no international movement against sexual apartheid as there was against the original one in South Africa.
On another note, thanks again for indulging me with your images on your website.
sincerely,
The Highwayman.
I don’t know why, but after this post was made I expected someone, anyone, to make a particular comment in response, but since I see it hasn’t been made I feel the need to make it.
I find it really, really problematic for your organisation to use the burdens of others this way. You don’t have to look at countries on the other side of the world full of brown people in order to find injustice. A trans woman was beaten to death last month in the Bronx. Young women of color are just as prone to be victims of the NYPD’s racial profiling program as young men are. The U.S. is just as capable of being a source of injustice as any country in the world, and I hope in the future you can find a more local inspiration for your activities.
We would never suggest that the U.S. is perfect or that injustice doesn’t exist here. The reason we wrote about the situation in Egypt is that one of our members just came back from Egypt and told us about her disturbing experiences there. If she’d described disturbing experiences somewhere else, we would have relayed those.
Yes, there are frightening and heartbreaking and infuriating crimes against women and people of color right here in New York, and those do inspire us, too.
That said, be careful of falling into the trap of false equivalence. The fact that you can find cases of mistreatment of women both in New York and in Egypt doesn’t mean that there is no difference between the two. The systemic oppression of women in the Middle East is of a different type and degree than its counterpart in New York. That doesn’t mean there are no problems for us to fix here–there are. But denying that there is a difference is just deluded.
To those who say it’s someone’s right to cover up or not – perhaps that’s true. But I also question why men can dress in standard Western attire whereas women must cover up? If it were truly about modesty, why don’t men cover their heads, arms, etc.? It’s a complete double standard enforced by religion. I admit I have a hard time with all of this because I’m as liberal and open-minded as they come and hate all forms of religious prejudice as well.
You ladies are wonderful. To Jack, Free1, and anyone else who think ladies in Islamic countries “choose” to cover up because it is their religion you are delusional. Women in these countries get acid thrown in their face, and stoned to death if they are accused of breaking religous laws. Women don’t want to follow these laws. Father from an Islamic countries find this out all the time when they immigrate to U.S.
On a side note you ladies are wonderful.
I remember this beautiful girl on last year’s post. I think it was by the end of 2012 she didn’t appear anymore. Then she used a short hairdress, now she wears long hair. Is nice to make trips an to know other cultures, but unless she has a duty to do there it was really risky to go to those places in Asia wich are currently the boiling side of the world. You didn’t said either that rapes with dead women are common daily news in India, commited by same law forces and that on Israel neighborhood is Syria….
Well at least she’s at safe, healthy, smiling, with a wonderful body shape, but specially topless…. that’s what matter. Hoping she´ll return to the Society meetings.
I like the new tagline!
There is a (small) amount of discussion amongst naturists going on in the UK about this after a right wing politician appeared on BBC Breakfast, trying to get people covering their faces in public banned. He used as an example the fact that public nudity in the UK is illegal….which it isn’t. see. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p01gk4yc
You know, I’ve wanted to comment on the beauty I see on display here and I quite can’t find the right word. Beautiful, lovely, sexy, hot. . . they could all apply, but not quite what I’m experiencing. And then it hit me:
Glorious.
You’re all glorious.
You’re all The Angel of Mons.
The Prophet Muhammed, I think, would be appalled by the oppression being perpetrated today in his name by egotistic, power-hungry men who can’t be bothered to actually study and understand his teachings.
There’s not much we can do about other cultures’ problems from over here, except draw attention to how foolish and sad such men are. But we can certainly lead by example, and get rid of the inequalities remaining in our own society.
Male-female equality, wherever it is possible to achieve it, is essential to a healthy society. Period. There are a handful of cases where parity will never be achieved (in the fire department, for instance, where there are simply very few women physically capable of doing the job) but wherever it’s possible to do so, we have to make equality happen.
Appreciate your comments, and everyone else’s. But just a warning that if the comments being posted escalate from the airing of opposing views into something more like a shouting match or an exchange of insults, we’re going to take those comments off the site. I mention this because we deleted two such comments this morning that were just gratuitous slagging. If you don’t see your comment on here, that’s why.
We had something to say and we said it. You agree or disagree, feel strongly or don’t, okay. On we go.
wooww, i like reading and sexy …
Hey, I was wondering about the cultural/political/religious (or something else) significance of the woman with the square scars on her legs. It looks decorative and I was wondering what they mean, if anything, and how she got them on her legs. I posted a prior query but it didn’t get posted or responded to–I’m not trying to violate any rules with my question but she appears relatively frequently and I’m curious about the look.
Since the question keeps coming up…over and over…figured we might as well answer it once and for all. Yes, one of our members has square scars on her legs. They’re self-administered. They don’t have any cultural, political, or religious significance, any more than her tattoos do. Just another form of body art.
Great and thanks for responding to the question, and for doing so while you were overseas (what customer service!). If possible, can you answer how she did the self administered body art, and how she got them so square and I think on both legs? It looks like some sort of branding, and likely painful to get the scars, and I can’t imagine how I’d do it. Again, I’m not trying to violate any rules by asking but I know how tattoos, piercings and even tongue splitting is done, but this is new to me (and I guess to others).
Argh. See, that’s why we weren’t answering. Because there’s no end to the questions. And I know you’re asking out of honest curiosity and the best of motives, but still. We don’t want to keep talking about it. You’re entitled to your curiosity, and we respect it. But we’re not obliged to answer, so respectfully we’re going to demur. Just think of her as a magician who’s performed a terrific illusion. Don’t ask how it was done. Just enjoy the display.
I missed the lass with the perfect imperfection as well… very glad that she’s back and safe
I demur to your demurral. I just thought that it may mean something further, or that it was like an artist willing to discuss their art. Thanks again for responding and for understanding my honest curiosity and best of motives.
What you say is spot on! Liberty and freedom is the cornerstone for our country. BTW luv the ink and your conservative body mod.
[…] Unlike my stories, the Outdoor Co-ed Topless Pulp Fiction Appreciation Society is doing good work. They are actively expanding the public female space. If you want to feel wholesome and clean as you ogle their skin-filled blog, read some of their mission statement in their post On Modesty: […]
Do you see no class component to what you are doing? How many women in America have the time to sit around in a park? How many would feel their bodies likely to be praised so effusively? Is nudity and modesty strictly a matter of oppression – for example, can you imagine any hue and cry from black Baptist women to go topless? Does this mean they are oppressed by their religion? Maybe. But I see your pictures, and I see a particular kind of person, and I have a great deal of trouble imagining others feeling so comfortable in the park with almost nothing on. I am not claiming to have the answers to my questions. I’m curious why no seems to want to ask them.
There is a class component to almost everything in the world, so to say there isn’t one here would be absurd. But if you imagine that we’re all well-to-do, you’re wrong. A few of us are, but most of us don’t have much money and some of us are actively struggling to make ends meet. The wonderful thing about New York’s public parks is that they’re for everyone, rich and poor. And more important for the poor — the rich have private terraces to retreat to, but the rest of us have Central Park. Lying on the grass reading a book is a free pleasure anyone can enjoy (even the book can be free, if you get it from the library). As for “How many women have the time to sit around in a park?”, we all do, unless we’re literally working 7 days a week. In fact, one of our members WAS working 7 days/week recently to make her rent (she has since moved to a cheaper place), and she made a point of carving out an hour to sit with us in the park anyway, because she needed a little time off to recharge and regain her sanity by doing something she really enjoyed.
As for religion, it’s probably true that most deeply religious people are unlikely to engage in public toplessness, because they’ve internalized the prohibitions against such behavior that their religions promote. But you might be surprised. We have some members who won’t come to an event on a Saturday because they’re observant Jews, but who sunbathe topless with us the other 6 days of the week. We’ve certainly had plenty of people join us who grew up with a strongly religious upbringing but enjoy what we do nevertheless. Have we had any Baptists? No idea. But we’ve certainly had Christians of various denominations. We’re not all godless atheists (though many of us are).
In any event: thank you for posing these thoughtful questions. But no one should be too quick to assume the answers.
And yet you have published pictures of two extremely fit and conventionally beautiful women (no men of course because penises are aggressive and scary while breasts are nurturing and positive). You tell me there is diversity in nudity. Yet not ONCE have you or I ever seen a picture of black nudists. Think about this a little, and maybe you’ll see why. Because modesty is not simple. And nudity can be an expression of power in more ways than one. If you believe that there is always a class component, why so quick to dismiss it, why no curiosity about what your statement might mean to others with a very different history of the body and of sex? When a white, physically fit woman sits topless in central park ( and omg you really can’t hear yourself about NYC being accommodating in its public spaces to the poor?), it means something completely different than if an overweight woman of color does it. And that is not simply a function of the male gaze, but of the white middle class gaze as well. Sex can’t be separated entirely from power by taking your shirt off. The exercise as presented here is bathed in self – delusion about the people all around you.
You’re just arguing to hear yourself argue. We HAVE published pictures of men (including some of penises, which we only find aggressive and scary when they are being used in aggressive and scary ways). We have many members who are women of color, and you’ll find them in photos throughout our blog (just go to the top of our home page and start scrolling down; most of us may be white, but you’d need to be blind to think we all are). And we’re not all physically fit. Some of us are skinny, some are fat; some are in great shape, some are not. And yes, NYC is accommodating in its public spaces to the poor — maybe not as much as it could or should be, but you don’t have to have money to go sit in Central Park. And NYC has many, many parks where someone can go for a moment of peace and quiet whether she has a Trump-sized bank account or no bank account at all.
We’re happy to think about and civilly discuss issues of class and race and politics; it’s absolutely true that the same act can mean different things, or be harder or easier to perform without censure or risk, for two people of different races or different physical appearances. But we’re not going to get into a shouting match with an arrogant hothead who can’t even be bothered to get his facts straight when it would be trivially simple for him to do so. (Next time, Ken, try actually looking at the photos on a blog before excoriating the photographer for what you erroneously think they must contain.)
You’ll probably try to get the last word by writing another comment, but happily this is our blog and we get to decide what appears on it. Future comments from you will be deleted unread.
Don’t read it fine. You’re still a privileged American idiot with no clue about what life is like outside your little NYC club. Please do fuck off.
Just for the fun of it, we figured we’d let everyone see your true colors. “Arrogant hothead” turned out to be about right.
Nudity is good. Sexual is good. Sexy is good. Some of us try to spend entirely too much time in other people’s heads. Religion is good if people get to view it and choose for themselves. It the forcing and the violence that are bad.
Peace.